The y DNA results published in http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~mozhayski/teksty/yd... display that a prince Lobanov-Rostovsky, a prince Shahovskoi, a Solomin, a Mozharovsky, and two current Russian princes descending from the Starodub line, belong to essentially the very same y DNA, which is under the haplotype now coded as N1c1a but mentioned as N3a1 in the table.
This haplotype is seemingly Finnic-Ugric, and shared by a lot of men in Finland and with Finnish roots.
Ryurik and his closest had undoubtedly Norse names, not Finnic. But he is often thought to have come from seashore of Roslagen, itself a place near Finland and possibly earlier inhabited by Finnic tribe(s) before german-originated Norse took over at the place.
the six, or five, Ryurikids tested, according to traditional genealogy come from the family tree which branches in following spots:
gen I Yaroslav Vladimirovich, monarch of Novgorod and Kiev, bc 980s sons included:
gen II Svyatoslav Yaroslavich, bc 1027, ancestor of the Chernigov - founder of the lineage which produced the Puzyna
gen II Vsevolod Yaroslavich, bc 1030, ancestor of big-russian lines son:
gen III Vladimir Vsevolodich 'the Monomakh', b 1053 sons included:
gen IV Mstislav Vladimirich, b 1076 - his son gen V Rostislav of Smolensk had son gen VI David of Smolensk, whose son gen VII Mstislav of Smolensk had son gen VIII Rostislav of Smolensk bc 1210s, whose two sons gen IX Gleb of Smolensk (bc 1230s) and gen IX Fedor of Yaroslavl (bc 1238) started the two branches which led, respectively, probably to the Mozharovsky and certainly to the Solomin
gen IV Yuriy Vladimirich 'Dolgorukiy', bc 1090s, George I of Russia, whose youngest son was:
gen V, Vsevolod Yuriyevich 'the Great Nest', b 1154; whose sons included:
gen VI, Kostantin Vsevolodich, prince of Rostov, bc 1186, who should be ancestor of the Lobanov-Rostovski sample
gen VI, seemingy the youngest, Ivan Vsevolodich 'Kasha', prince of Starodub, b 1198, who should be ancestor of the two Gagarin samples
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the branchings of the samples in table above, seemingly branched in II, IV, VI and IX generation. Which are, generally, around 20-29 generations earlier than samples.
(except the two Gagarins are much closer kinsmen of each other, practically only one sample in this view)
This set of results surprises me a bit: so many mutations in one little millennium; so many mutations in just about 20 generations. wow.
sorry, Solomin are from the Smolensk branch, as could also Mozharovskiy be.
Yaroslavl branch (separate since IX generation, about twenty generations ago) produced Shahovski.
thus, Solomin and Mozharovski should be closer with each others than with anybody else. If they are not, then Mozharovsky family legends probably were incorrect.
sorry, Solomin are from the Smolensk branch, as could also Mozharovskiy be.
Yaroslavl branch (separate since IX generation, about twenty generations ago) produced Shahovski.
thus, Solomin and Mozharovski should be closer with each others than with anybody else. If they are not, then Mozharovsky family legends probably were incorrect.
I am "hot"-linked by my YDNA - to 2 Polish families -- HOSPODY & KLOSOWSKI..but have no idea how. This goes back 700 - 1000 yrs. Am trying hard to solve this odd mystery Those 2 guys have a documented "line" virtually back to 1015 AD...linked with MAGNUS/MAGNUSKI & the very famous SKARBEK clan (who were also of some unknown Viking descent). All noble families.
Maybe it's one of these routes: (a) via AUDO/AUDOEN--Awdanieks. Audo was a Norman knight in the early 1000's who lived in Poland with a band of knghts (as per Gallus Anonimus) (b) a (Viking) ancestor of the Hohenstaufen progenitor - Frederick I Barbarossa who invaded Poland in 1256?--lnked to Berbancon?-Brabant, Bourbon (c) RYURIK & some kind of alleged link to the name BARBASH/BARBASCH--- which is basically Barbarossa --see above--Is this a real linkage?? (d) via HRING (Anulo) the Viking - - - with whom I have lots of "hits" via other medieval links down through various French/British lines....
I was just wondering if all this RYURIK DNA stuff is on YSEARCH. Then i can run some automatic cross-matches. Looks like you're running some interesting stuff there!!
> Ryurik and his closest had undoubtedly Norse names, not Finnic. But he is often thought to have come from seashore of Roslagen, itself a place near Finland and possibly earlier inhabited by Finnic tribe(s) before german-originated Norse took over at the place.
In a message dated 7/29/2008 4:15:30 PM Pacific Daylight Time,
gjcold...@yahoo.com writes: > I am "hot"-linked by my YDNA - to 2 Polish families -- HOSPODY & > KLOSOWSKI..but have no idea how. This goes back 700 - 1000 yrs. Am > trying hard to solve this odd mystery>>>
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I'm curious how you can be certain that this goes back 700 to 1000 years.
Will Johnson
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