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Newsgroups: sci.energy, sci.energy.hydrogen
From: "Karl Johanson" <karljohan...@shaw.ca>
Date: Thu, 13 Mar 2003 16:26:45 GMT
Local: Thurs, Mar 13 2003 11:26 am
Subject: Re: YA Hydrogen article - positive this time
"Thomas Lee Elifritz" <f...@reverse-o-matic.com> wrote
> Neil Adams wrote: > > That's the point: hydrogen is an energy store. You have to make it first > More thermodynamics from morons, for morons. Wait, you used it twice in one sentence, you're doubly smart. > > So what are you going to make it with? You need energy in specific forms. What you want is usable energy. When you > Ummm, ... energy? have usable energy, you have to make the case as to why you want to use it to make hydrogen (to store a percentage of the energy) rather than to use it directly. Then you have to make the case that using hydrogen will be a more efficient, convenient and economical method of storing energy than other storage technologies (batteries, flywheels, pumped hydro, compressed air, boron/O2, etc.) > > It's like saying that we're going to use batteries for energy. We also use pumped hydro and compressed air for storage as well. The point > Actually we use batteries for energy storage and conversion just like is that storage isn't a primary energy source, it's a technology for load levelling or for off grid applications. >Energy is conserved, if you haven't noticed yet. Yes, but converting usable energy from one form to another leaves you with less usable energy. That's a physical law, not a technological shortcoming of existing devices. The total amount of energy still exists, but much of it is diffuse heat. > > Even if the hydrogen cycle can be made a bit So, referring to hydrogen as a 'source' of energy is wrong*. It's like > > more efficient than current batteries, you must first charge them or > > manufacture the hydrogen using energy. > So what. referring to buckets as 'sources' of water or refrigerators as 'sources' of food. (*Unless the conjectured 20 km deep pockets of free hydrogen turn out to be Karl Johanson You must Sign in before you can post messages.
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