Google Groups Home
Help | Sign in
Message from discussion $cientology's "RPF" Slave Labor Camps
The group you are posting to is a Usenet group. Messages posted to this group will make your email address visible to anyone on the Internet.
Your reply message has not been sent.
Your post was successful
Kevin Brady  
View profile
 More options Mar 18 2001, 1:10 pm
Newsgroups: alt.religion.scientology
From: "Kevin Brady" <rocks...@hotmail.com>
Date: Sun, 18 Mar 2001 18:02:34 GMT
Local: Sun, Mar 18 2001 1:02 pm
Subject: Re: $cientology's "RPF" Slave Labor Camps

"Kymus" <kymus2...@aol.comnospam> wrote in message

news:20010318111733.07138.00001524@ng-cp1.aol.com...

> >From: "Kevin Brady" rocks...@hotmail.com

> >Kymus-

> >please.  The above working conditions you describe were SOUGHT OUT by the
> >people you describe.  Not forced upon them as punitive justice.  The
course
> >work you describe is not typically the material a scientologist wants to
> >study, but KSW materials, Command Chain materials, and Ethics issues.
They
> >are subjected to Sec Checking under duress.  They CANNOT LEAVE.

> What you describe might be true of some people's RPF experience, and I
have
> heard a few credible stories of people being actively physically detained
in
> the RPF - Stacy Brooks for instance.  I believe the bulk of RPF staff have
> remained due to moral constraints and not physical restraint.  They are in
the
> first place Sea Org members, a status they sought out with an
understanding
> that it would become central to who they are and how they spend all their
> available time, indicating a preexisting high level of commitment to their
> faith and to enduring harsh conditions and meager rewards to promote it.
They
> are in the second place able to avoid the RPF by leaving the Sea Org, and
at
> least grudgingly acquiesce to RPF membership. You forget that few
Scientology
> facilities are located outside urban areas, the RPF is working on grounds
of
> major Sea Org facilities and can easily leave the grounds if that is what
they
> choose, though they would face punitive treatment if they left and tried
to
> come back.  There appears to be some exception regarding the Gold base,
though
> even there it is hardly a prison camp, just slightly more rural and
subject to
> temptations to commit acts of detention or intimidation.

Where would these people go?  They have no money, no clothes, no food, and
all of their friends are organization members.  Where is the support base to
escape Flag?  Hitch-hike?  Where?  Lose your bridge for eternity?  After so
much hard work already under the bridge?

You are probably right that there is little physical restraint used,
although I practically had to knock my E/O out to get past her when I was
taking flight.  Now she acts like I was expelled, but really they were
pleading with me up until my last day to figure out some solution other than
dropping my hat.  However, I was near my parents houses, and could easily
hitch-hike home, or they would have come and gotten me.

The SO specializes in hard-selling the idealist which volunteer for service,
totally unwitting about the deception and fraud they are subjecting
themselves to.  Yes, they know there will be long hours, and that they will
be called upon to give their life in a good cause, if necessary.  But they
are told they will be the elite of scientology.  Only SO can be Class XII.
There are many SO only training actions, and I assume the same is true on
the processing side of the bridge (I have never heard of gang-bang
sec-checks on Class IV [V now?] org staff or public).  You get the snappy
naval uniform, the chance to work on the Ship, or the Mecca of Technical
perfection.  You could get trained up to be part of the Universe Corps esto
team when the org you came from goes Saint Hill (I'm still holding my breath
on Boston).  You are trained that there is no more important or ethical
activity that you could engage in, for the next billion years.  And when you
arrive?  Rice and beans.  Bad teeth.  No medical attention.  Exhaustion.
Tone 40 Control techniques.  Almost as if the SO were specifically designed
to dishearten idealistic scientologists.  Ruin self-esteem.  The job you did
is NEVER good enough, unless stats are 5.4x, while OSA keeps foot-bulleting,
prices keep rising, staff and public keep leaving.  It is so bleak that you
think, with all this tech, I must be the problem.  And you might search
yourself, introverting for years, and never find the awful thing you must be
hiding, even from yourself.  I JUST COGGED.  HOLY SHIT  :)     They were
deliberately creating the missed withhold of nothing phenomena.  Alienating
me from myself!  All that time, I bought it.  Anyway, I am sure this same
bit happens to lots of staff, which is why they are always so downtone about
what's going on with their own pursuits.  They are failures!  Just look at
the orgs!  Look at the fucking 35 dollars that is your paycheck.  It almost
makes me want to cry, thinking about it.  I make that much in two hours,
these days, and have plans to make it in one.  In a society that measures
success by how well you stack up against the Jones', how do you think these
people feel.  And they work so bleeding hard...   Too bad really.   If they
weren't adults, the things done to them, wittingly or not would be
considered neglect, mental abuse and cruelty, and they would become wards of
the state.

> >Surely you can see that this is a human rights violation?  If not
slavery,
> >it is imprisonment and psychological torture, accompanied by total
> >disconnection from their families and friends.

> No, I don't see that.  Staff membership in the Sea Organization is founded
on
> consensual relationships that terminate when the person wishing to
terminate it
> decides.  Consent eliminates violation.

Consent given under fraudulent claims and misrepresentation of the actual
situation?

> RPFers have family time like other staff, are not imprisoned, and are not
> psycholoigcally tortured by RPF activities to any greater extent than they
are
> psychologically tortured by the fact of existing in an apparently
pointless
> universe filled with suffering, i.e. suffer the common human condition, or
by
> undergoing counseling which exposes one's flaws and penetrates and defeats
> one's illadaptive defenses, in the manner some psychotherapy does.  If
reality
> therapy, gestalt, psychoanalysis, etc. are all torture then I'd accept
that the
> RPF is too.  Since their Sea Org membership, a necessary precondition to
RPF
> membership, is their own chosen response to the uncomfortable fact of
being
> alive, in an effort to make living in it not hopeless and needlessly
painful, I
> don't see how it should be described as torture.

Life is not hopeless and needlessly painful.  Its a pissing good time when
you get the people away from you that drag you down, discover something
valuable about yourself and begin exchanging it with the wider MORE ETHICAL
world outside the Church.  In fact, just having to point that out to you
gets me kind of depressed.  I might have to go have a beer, some good food
at 30 dollars a plate, and contemplate how narrowly I avoided serfdom to the
Church.

> >Almost enough to induce
> >first circuit shock, sometimes actually passing that threshhold.  Would
you
> >condone this?

> Why are you trying to argue to deprive some people's capacity to choose
their
> religion and manner of affiliation with it based on a psychobabble
accusation
> that lacks good evidence, being based on a biased take on a
nonrepresentative
> sample of a subculture?  That's a Scientology tactic to take an instance
> without questioning if it is representative and fashion a specious theory
about
> it and call all that proof of something.  Why are you coming up with your
own
> variation on it?

I am not arguing to deprive people of their religion, or anything else.  You
are representing as if the SO were forthcoming about the actual stats on
scientology to their applicants, that they are told the truth about actual
conditions, that they are aware of the actions of their organization-  in
short, as if it were bound by workplace laws, subject to any kind of
oversight from unbiased parties (and Ron ensured that Scientology would
never consider ANY outside party unbiased or able).  They are deceiving
people, which is why they need the hard sell, and why staff members are
afraid of SO missions, why public disappear when the SO arrives.  I never
got it, because I was an idealist, and thought that maybe the other people
around me had compromised their own integrity so severely that they could
not see the opportunity working for the SO was.  Backwards.  They all saw,
clearer than myself, that the SO destroys orgs with their "helpful"
missions, that cost the org about ten thousand dollars per day, that there
were things being done that average scientologists didn't agree with but
certainly did not want to confront management over, due to concerns about
loss of bridge, disconnection, etc.

> There are distinctly specific instances where RPF members have been
abused.  I
> have seen or been subject to the same abuses or worse in public schools,
health
> care institutions, workplaces, etc.  In each case the remedy is particular
to
> the case rather than being in a campaign to simply label the entire
institution
> with Nazi-laden imagery.

There is not a global policy covering the institution of this abuse in the
other cases you are thinking of.  The Church doesn't have isolated
incidents, where this happens as an accident, it is all there in red/green
on white.  Or in SO mission orders, as the case may be, although these are
probably destroyed after a sensitive, possible out-pr outcome.  The
"isolated incidents" don't happen by some dude getting up and acting on his
own- NO.  It happens because some dude applies POLICY, because he is a
fanatic who has lost sight of his own decency due to exhaustion,
malnutrition, Tone 40, "ethics", sec checking.  The real reason an SO member
doesn't leave isn't because he is necessarily afraid of reprisal, but
because he is afraid he would have to admit that he had slid down a slippery
slope of increasingly betraying his own internal compass, and mortgaged his
awareness to the "greater good" of scientology INTERNATIONAL, which he is
continually lied to about.  GIGO, buddy.

> Granted, I have never been on the RPF but I've known those who have and
seen it
> up close.  There is no representative depiction of the RPF as "slave labor
> camps" that is founded on anything but hysteria and venom.  I agree that
it is
> tragic that some people have had wrongful acts committed against them in
the
> RPF and believe these specific instances merit legal redress.

I think that the entire SO was a solution to a dangerous environment, that
it continued to be enacted after the danger had passed (an overt solution in
the first place), and that it should be disbanded.  But since members of
this organization have created an inner cabal, and seized control of the
Church from the inside, perhaps with help from the IRS, I don't think the SO
will be letting go until the last PC dies in Introspection.  See LRH's own
policy on Group Engram handling, I believe in the first or second Tech
Volume.  After the dangerous situation has passed (all bypasses are to be
TEMPORARY), the exec is supposed to explain why it was necessary, how the
situation was handled, and resume NORMAL operation.

Ach.  I need sleep.

I appreciate your genuine exchange, here.  I am sorry if I seem impatient.
There is more to this story, for me (can you smell the bypassed charge?)

kgb
rocks...@hotmail.com

> =  The a.r.s. prime directive: Make Jokes About Scientologist's Deaths=

> Example, regarding Attorney Moxon and his UNFORTUNATE loss:   "Maybe he
> believes there are no underground transformer vaults in Europe."  (JB
> Lingerman)


    Reply to author    Forward  
You must Sign in before you can post messages.
To post a message you must first join this group.
Please update your nickname on the subscription settings page before posting.
You do not have the permission required to post.

Create a group - Google Groups - Google Home - Terms of Service - Privacy Policy
©2008 Google