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Newsgroups: alt.religion.scientology
From: Wolf <wolft...@micron.net>
Date: 1998/06/05
Subject: Re: Is it true?
Finally got around to answering this. Starshadow wrote: I just don't know what to say Starshadow... you don't want to demonize > In article <356FB37A.5...@micron.net>, wolft...@micron.net says... > I'm very aware of that tendency. I have a daughter who always judges in them, yet you still refer to them as a cult. What would you call that? A compliment? > > I hate to split hairs, but it's my specialty. I'll acknowledge that some I think a better way of putting it may be 'you have heard reports of' > > in the GO/OSA power circle may have culled data from folders. By > > pointing out that professionals have been accused and found guilty in > > other arenas of similar breaches in confidence I'm not attempting to > > lessen what may have been done by GO people. In either instance it's > > contemptable. But a mental health professional or attorney who violates > > confidentiality doesn't make all his/her peers guilty by association. > > Nor does the random act by a GO/OSA member. *Scientology* doesn't use pc > > folders to blackmail anymore than *psychiatry* uses session notes to > > blackmail. > I have seen too many incidents of the above to think it is just such things. If it's their unwritten policy then it's not something that can be resolved here. How do you ever prove an unwritten policy? And unless you have enough proof to actually bring charges of blackmail or extortion, then it's all just hot air. They still have my folders... I'd bet there's some juicy stuff in there too. So what? > The PI I'm speaking of *stole* photos and misrepresented himself. There I just read an accusation of Scn harrassment from a guy who got back > are numerous other such instances I've seen detailed here. It's not > happening to me, but then I think I'm not perceived as much of a threat. from vacation and finding several pay phone calls on his caller ID, proceeded directly to ARS and wrote a big report on OSA harrassing him. He even gave the freaking pay phone numbers and dates. Duh. Some harrassment eh? They wait for him to leave town and then dial his number? And then when he gets back.. nothing. Here's what I think. I think some harrassment has been done. I think virtually every (not every, but virtually) report to ARS is edited to appeal to the mindset of the group. I have also read numerous reports of so-called harrassment where it was painfully obvious that the poster was praying it was harrassment... because that's the way to get recognition on this ng. How do you sort the truth out from the BS? Answer. You really don't. Nobody has the resources or even the desire to track down every dead animal, phone call, man with sunglasses and bad credit report. Sometimes shit happens just because. Reading ARS you'd have to think SCN *does* have OT's if they can create that much disruption. > > My aim here is to at Believe it or not, most mysterious coincidences are well within the > > least suggest that some of the emotional heat pumped into the alleged > > harrassment may be bs. ARS hard-liners call that the act of an > > 'apologist'. Personally I see it more as adding a little sense to the > > issue. > Whatever. I think that's your spin, and you and I see it differently. normal probability ranges. How hard is it for someone who is bigoted towards a class of people (you know.. clams, evil cultists, death cult, criminal cult... bigotry) to jump to the conclusion they're being harrassed when something fairly routine happens. The cat thing had me laughing so hard I woke my kid up. For Christ's Sake! There are about 900 million cats in America. How hard is it to believe you may occassionaly see a dead one? Yes. Even on your porch. Only on ARS would this be reported as harrassment, seconded and then generate a long argumentative thread. And you claim you believe what you read here? > And anyway why This is a rhetorical question, right? Who else would they hire to > does OSA have to hire PIs to investigate anyway? investigate? > I criticise the Pope, Last time I checked being a PI is a legal and legitimate business. If > and many do, but I've not seen accounts similar of a Vatican > investigation of their critics. Why does a church need lawyers and PIs in > the first place, let alone a "boot camp" etc. etc. you ever need one, you'll be able to answer the question yourself. I can't answer for the Pope or the vatican, but I've heard rumor that entire armies had been raised in the past and that they even have their own military to protect his holiness. Now why do you suppose that is? Is there a chance that there is an entire group of hate-filled bigots out there who would love to get another shot at him? > According to their own logs they applied the "tech" as laid down by Beats me. But I suspect the answers to your questions as well as the > policy. And if the church had nothing to hide, why smuggle the perps out > of the country and hide them? Why obfusticate investigators, and scream > "Liar, bigot" etc etc? Why at a memorial for Lisa, a candle light > memorial, did official church people emerge and blow out vigil candles??? truth of whether they did any of those things will eventually come out. Not on ARS thankfully. But in the justice system, where it belongs. > WTF are the bigots here??? The critics who post here who are bigots are also prejudiced. I can > (Parm me, I get a bit hot under the collar at this constant > characterization of critics as bigots and prejudiced people. Like I said, > I'm bigoted against abuse and that is what I see the cult doing.) read. I'm not sure 'bigoted against abuse' is a proper usage of the word. > > First we have the 'witch' problem, now we're relying on karmic wheels. The vision of a karmic wheel running me over is delightful. I told a > > Might I point out gently Starshadow that belief in such things is as > > weird as belief in BT's and evil SF space empires? > Whatever. You can refuse to believe in the karmic wheel all you want, friend of mine about your comment and she agreed with you wholeheartedly. I still like her too, despite the fact that she has some looney belief in karma and vegetables ;-) > I think that even stupid people can rake in money, but it catches up to That's quite different than what I hear. It's more an economy of scale > them eventually. It must already be. They aren't expanding, they are > shutting down orgs all over, or is that missions and churches all over? thing. After all, they do charge enormous sums. Perhaps they are doing better than ARS would like to believe? > Not having ever been in this particular cult, I haven't the language down I am indeed the epitomy of a sales professional Starshadow. Glib, > pat, so I may misspeak from time to time. I'm glad you are thriving. You > must be in sales, right? I love your last two sentences. (We'll have to > share sales stories sometime.) charismatic, undeniably handsome and sincere and a firm believer that it's an honorable and fulfilling vocation. Besides which, my only other schooling is as an auditor and I don't have any bloody choice if I want to eat! > > Huh? Did you snooze through history class? I'm not suggesting ARS isn't I've been hearing that on ARS for four years. Before ARS I was hearing > > a threat. What I _am_ suggesting is that CofS doesn't see it as a great > > threat right now. You'll know whn they do, of that you can be sure. > I think they are running out of ammo. They keep running out of toes, it as far back as the early 60's. I was in Scn when the FDA banned emeters. Same thing, less media. Critics now think the net is what forms world opinion and they think ARS forms public opinion about Scn. If you think that, I can see why you align yourself with some of the scoundrels you do. Wolf You must Sign in before you can post messages.
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